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Speaker 1: [00:00:00] Welcome to the English learner portal podcast with your host Kelly Reider get ready for the support. You've been searching for to help your English Learners succeed in the classroom whether you are classroom teacher or an ESL specialist Kelly's got you covered with proven best [00:00:15] practices to help you engage equip and Empower your English learners. Hello English learner portal Community. We are back with episode 2 of our podcast. I'm so glad you are [00:00:30] joining us for today's podcast. I want to continue on a topic that's been of great interest recently the other day. We did a webinar about newcomers [00:00:45] and students with limited or interrupted formal education sci-fi or slave students and the Was tremendous hundreds of people signed up for this webinar, which tells me it's an area of [00:01:00] great need. So we are going to continue focusing on our newcomer sife students for the month of February back in the beginning of the school year. I did [00:01:15] a Blog about newcomer social emotional Wellness a couple different things we did in that series there. So for this podcast today, I want to replay for you the audio from [00:01:30] an interview I did with Joe Hudson who is the Hispanic liaison officer for the Annapolis Police Department and Annapolis, Maryland. I had the pleasure of working with Joe for a few years [00:01:45] while I worked for the school system there and so let's pick up. That interview that we did because what Joe has to say is always important and always crucial when you are working [00:02:00] with newcomer students. So let's join the interview now this month. We are talking to Joe Hudson who I had the pleasure of working with in the last school system where I worked and I'm going to let Joe introduce [00:02:15] himself and then Joe if you could just talk a little bit about the students you work with what you're seeing and anything that you think is important for teachers to know when working with our students as far as [00:02:30] trauma and social-emotional health go.
Speaker 2: Okay. Hi, my name is Joe Hudson on the Latino. Liaison for the Annapolis Police Department. And my primary function is to work in the community engage the community and [00:02:45] kind of be that mediator between the police department and the community a lot of the work that I do I do in the schools working with children holding Mentor sessions working with parents that [00:03:00] are involved with the school system. So what kind of want to take two different paths here right now and talk about what I'm saying recently and then talk about how that also combines with the kids [00:03:15] that have been here. And right now we're seeing a lot of kids coming into the county and Annapolis and Anne Arundel County. And the thing that they all have in common is they're coming up with a lot of trauma that trauma is generated [00:03:30] in their home country. With the amount of violence that's happening the poverty that's having that it's in their home countries and then that Journey coming up. So this past week, [00:03:45] I actually worked with two different kids and one of them was an 11 year old girl who is from El Salvador that paid a coyote to bring them up. It was her the mother and so their first night as they go [00:04:00] they crossed over into Guatemala and they crossed into Mexico and that first night. We're in the back of a truck with seven other people and the coyotes driving them up and that first night a rival cartel stops the truck pulls everybody out at gunpoint [00:04:16] start shooting out the windows of the car and they start trying to take everybody's cell phones and money what little money they had and everything and they ended up shooting the guy that was next to this little girl in the back of the head a little girl starts screaming [00:04:32] they're yelling at her. Her saying that she needs to be quiet or they're going to kill her. They put the guy in the trunk that they had shot. They try to put the little girl in there and just a horrible traumatic experience. And that's typical for a lot of these kids [00:04:47] that are coming up or even the adults that are coming up and sometimes excuse me on the way up. They may be afraid of victim of sex assault tution. They might be put into [00:05:02] a factory to work. And at night they sleep in what is called safe houses and you might have a hundred people stacked into the house and that's just it's a very traumatic experience. Especially if your child [00:05:17] is traveling by himself or herself and then when they get to the border, so I've talked to kids that were in Immigration detention for up to five months and those things emotionally were not prepared to deal with so that's just a little sampling [00:05:32] of what happens when they come up. And then they have to get established here. And then when they get into the schools there most of them are placed in the Esau but because a lot of our kids have a broken education, [00:05:48] they might be 14 15 years old with only two or three years of schooling. So but because you can't put them in the second grade because of their age their in these advanced classes. They don't [00:06:03] have an idea of what's Going on so they struggle there and the teacher doesn't speak Spanish. They don't speak English. And so they struggle so that trauma just continues to carry forward right now because of the political situation and not knowing what's going on [00:06:18] as far as immigration. We also have that fear that we are parents may do be deported and if they're deported then the child is deported as well because they have no one to stay with but that what a lot of people don't [00:06:33] realize is that even kids. That were born here, but they have parents for undocumented they to live with that fear because as that's being discussed at the dinner table or for the family and while the parents are discussing that at night the child's hearing [00:06:48] that and so he get he becomes worried and frightened what happens if my parents get picked up because they're going to go to because even though they're US citizens. They don't have anybody to think it's with here. And so all those things just kind of build up.
Speaker 1: [00:07:03] So how do you see how would teachers know when they're in the classroom? I think are are high school middle school high school teachers are a little more aware because of the things that have been in the news [00:07:18] and understanding the older students who are coming by themselves and experiencing trauma, but I I honestly don't think elementary teachers are as of where we like to think that nothing bad happens to young children. [00:07:33] So what could teachers be looking for listening for just being aware of so they know if if something like that is impacting a student in their class. [00:07:48] Well,
Speaker 2: the first thing we need to do is be as engaged the students, you know, if we took that student and said, all right, if this is my son and this is the first day of school, how would I want the school to work with my child? What [00:08:03] a lot of times I see is that we don't take the parents and the kids and give them a tour of the school have a meet the teachers and so we just kind of said we unroll them. We take the parents to tell their child and goodbye and then we kind. [00:08:18] Stick the kid in the class and so he doesn't know anybody. It's a new surrounding for him. It's a new structure. I mean a lot of kids that I've talked to the schools aren't as nice as what we have here and they're also not safe [00:08:34] because gangs can come in and out of schools, especially up in the more remote regions. It's not uncommon for games to come in pull a bunch of kids out and said, you know, I need you to go do this. So there's probably a little bit of fear there is As well as especially [00:08:49] if they're like 4th and 5th grade because they may have experienced some of that, you know, and I suggest too that you know, maybe we partner the child up with somebody that that has been in the school that understands how things work at the school so that it's not a guessing game for that [00:09:04] child a lot of times, you know, we might see the kid either withdrawn. We might see the child or even at the other end where he's somewhat aggressive. Of [00:09:20] and unable to learn and one of the things that happens is that when a child get his traumatized and he doesn't know what that feeling is. He just knows that he doesn't feel right. He knows that it's something he can sense that something's [00:09:35] wrong, but he doesn't know what's wrong. He's drowning in that trauma and it gets to a point where they can't function and a lot of times that might look like it's a learning disability when it's really the child struggling with the trauma [00:09:50] within and he's focused more on that internal trauma than what's going on around him. And so when we struggle with that trauma, we're not able to focus on what that teachers telling us or what they're trying to get us to do or teach us because we're just so [00:10:05] focused on what's going on inside of us and why don't we feel normal? Why don't we feel right? And in the what I find especially with the younger kids is it if you develop Um a rapport with [00:10:20] them that if you just look at them and say tell me your story they'll just let it all out. And once they're able to express that they were able to start moving forward. But so many teachers that I talked to said. Well, we can't [00:10:35] ask them where they're from. We can't I said no you I'm not I didn't ask the child where he was from. You know, I said we've developed some common ground and you know, maybe it's about shoes. Maybe it's about her favorite foods. And then I said, you know, tell me your story tell [00:10:50] me tell me what your life has been like and they just started letting it out and that gives you something. The truth aware of what he that child is dealing with or even what his interests are so that you can start building off those pieces, but [00:11:05] once those children can talk about it and let it out they start to little start functioning and then maybe they'll want to talk to you about it again. But at least that lets you know that [00:11:20] hey, maybe I need to get them to the social worker. Maybe I need to get him some peer support whatever the case may be. But we have to ask those questions. We just can't assume that you know, this kid, you know just came up and everything [00:11:35] was good because he looks fine. It's the things that we can't see the damages the most.
Speaker 1: I think you made a couple good points that one being that here, you know American culture [00:11:50] is we automatically assume that schools are supposed to be a safe place. We all go in knowing that any time. There's something happens and an incident happens where the safety of a school [00:12:05] is it risk or an incident happens at a school there is outrage. Has schools are safe places and we know that and we assume that but you are absolutely correct that people coming from other places. That's not their experience. [00:12:20] So I think that would be important for teachers to know that that's our assumption here. We know when you walk in the door, you're pretty safe that child has no way to know that that may not have been their experience. So I like what you said [00:12:35] about taking the time to to greet them to orient them to talk. talk about it to talk about Safety and Security to build everything you said is about building relationships and trust [00:12:50] and it's interesting also that you say that someone saying they can't ask where you're from because that's helpful to know because there are misperceptions we can clear up and we can't ask immigration status, you [00:13:05] know, we can't ask if you have a passport or Visa or what but you can certainly Ask where someone's from and tell their story and I just put the the word of caution in there that before we ask that [00:13:20] as the adults in the school. We really need to make sure we know what resources there are tell me a little bit about I know there's a misperception that this mostly impacts older students. So talk a little bit about [00:13:35] what you see in the younger students the Elementary grades. Grades, especially even even like as young as kindergarten. What do you do you see in those ages?
Speaker 2: well [00:13:50] It does happen a lot with our elementary school kids and even our kindergarten kids and we don't always pick it up most kindergartners. The first couple weeks there. It's a new surrounding is the first time [00:14:05] they're really separated from their parents. And so at first these children are children may seem just like any other child, but what they're thinking in their mind, especially if they were picked up at the border by immigration [00:14:20] and Were separated from their parents there's a huge unknown their psyche which was traumatizing at the border because we're not we don't know what happened to our parents were not housed at the same place. We can't see them [00:14:35] and so once we get to school, yeah, we have that anxiety because our parents we're separated from our parents, but at the end of the day, we don't know that our parents are going to be home waiting for us. There's [00:14:50] a bed. So there's a huge difference there because if I'm born here, I know that I'm separated from my mom. But I know that she's going to be at home. I don't even consider anything else but at that younger age, you [00:15:05] know, where are they? Are they going to be there when I get home, you know what could happen because you know those discussions have taken place in the home and we hear that you know that we're in Immigration proceedings [00:15:20] and that we Have to go back and so all those emotions and everything are circling around and we don't know will Mom be home when I get home or will somebody have picked her up. So that's a huge difference and [00:15:35] it doesn't always present itself the same way. They don't and it also doesn't present differently than a child that just started kindergarten or just started first grade that because they do have that same separation, but [00:15:50] we know that Mom's probably going to be home when we get there. And that's there's that difference
Speaker 1: right there. Definitely so I know over the past couple years you you and some of your colleagues in the police department [00:16:05] partnered with the school system and with national Compadres Network. So tell us a little bit about what you've been doing and to help the students. So we talked about what's going on with them. So, [00:16:20] of course we want to be able to do something about it. So tell us a little bit about what you've been doing and it's been a Years now, so I'm sure you have a lot of lessons learned that other people can learn from some advice for others who are [00:16:35] trying to put together some programs for
Speaker 2: kids. Absolutely. So I guess we're going on five years now that we have did we hope to partner with national compilers network and we started first with a program called Hogan Mobley [00:16:51] which is builds core values into our young men's lives and the program itself was for ages 14 to 21 and We started running it right after we got [00:17:06] trained and we were excited and we started seeing a lot of value in the program teachers are coming back and saying hey what's going on? Why you know, what did you tell this kid? My parents were calling us saying hey, you know, I see [00:17:21] a change in my son's and what my son's behavior and you know, and that first time around it felt really good. We were excited, but we pretty much hand-picked our kids. Pictures that we already had connections with [00:17:36] and there was a certain level of respect there. And so yeah, that was a hugely successful that first time around and then we started picking kids that were referred to us that gives that we didn't necessarily [00:17:51] know kids that we didn't necessarily have a connection with you know, they we might have known their names but they didn't really know who we were and then we started seeing a difference in Attitude within the groups [00:18:06] that were still participating but they weren't they some of them may not necessarily buy into the program. And so the mindset, you know, we talked about it and we decided you know, as long as the kid [00:18:21] is participating and he's hearing the message when it's right for him. He'll start to use the tools that we provided for him. It's a lot like parenting we can tell them over and over and over again, but until They're ready to use that information. They're not [00:18:36] going to use it. And so over the five years we've seen cases where you know the kids for lack of a better term was a hot mess and group. He didn't always show up there with a clear head butt [00:18:51] or he really wasn't there because he wanted to be there but there was still participation there and five years down the road, you know, we have those we have conversations. It was like, you know what? I remember what you told me about that and it's really [00:19:06] helped me out or it's a you know, I used what you told me. And so and that's an example, you know, there were, you know use the tools when they're ready to use the tools and so from that point. It's been hugely successful the next year. We [00:19:21] added a program for the Girls Clubs and nachle which is the girls program in the girls are really excited about it. And now we then we added a component. um where we do got to go to some which [00:19:36] is the family strengthening program and that's probably the most enjoyable program because we'll get parents in there and a lot of times I don't know each other when they get there, but when we start having conversations, [00:19:51] they'll say, you know, I've had that problem and I tried this and it didn't work and they start talking amongst themselves about the problems that they're having and they're able to start helping themselves, which is huge and it makes those as connections we're [00:20:06] running the programs for Latino youth. We normally run them after school this last year. We started a new thing where we run the girls in one room the blues and other room in the parents in another room and we do it all the same time. So it's truly, you know, [00:20:21] the family can come out and I'll participate at their level but we're running it in schools. We have a school here, which is I don't know what to say disciplinary school, but it is because when the kids when they don't [00:20:36] know what to do with the kids in the regular school, they send them over to this other school, and we've been running the program. They're out of that. I will called California which is where this program is based out of and I said, you know what I have a lot of elementary school kids that are [00:20:51] struggling. I have a lot of elementary schools that are showing gang tendencies. And so what happened I said, I need an elementary school program. So we hashed over the phone over a couple of hours and now I run an elementary [00:21:06] school program, which is based on our 14 and up program. But the difference is it's a lot more visual. So if we're talking about anger management I talk about the boys being [00:21:21] fire in the girls being water, you know, both of those things are very destructive, but they also can be very healing. and so we use a lot I use a lot of pictures and we talk about those properties and then we talked about how that anger [00:21:36] inside of us can either destroy us or it could we can use it for something good and it works we talk about stereotypes and I have a picture of a 67 Cadillac this brand new and I'm picture of a 67 Cadillac the exact same color, [00:21:51] but it's been in a garage for 20 years and I said, so which car do you want because how We dress how we talk what we say, you know, all that rep is who we represent so we can either look like the new car that [00:22:06] everybody wants or we can look like the car to spend in the garage for 30 years. So the kids really get those visual concepts and it really really start to put those things into use is that we have to connect with kids at their level. I'm old my [00:22:21] boat. My knees don't work like they should but I have a class. I just had a class this last year that the kids love to dance. And so they challenged me and so every day we that I would go in there we would do a dance and that ends up being my best class. [00:22:37] Because they bought into me because I'm willing to do all those dances that they do and I don't know what they're called, but we do.
Speaker 1: I want video of that
Speaker 2: they have videos of that. [00:22:52] You know, so we have to figure out how to meet that kid at that level and where they are and connect with them the way that they were thinking,
Speaker 1: you know, when you already have a relationship with students where you started [00:23:07] in the beginning and then you can take it further in the group and I like the comparison to students. You're just meeting because that is all the evidence that the relationships matter and it takes time it takes time [00:23:22] to build trust. Us someone has experienced the more time it's going to take so you're right. If they're there they're present. You're not going to see, you know, a miracle transformation and eight weeks for every student that comes through your door, [00:23:37] but they know there's somebody to reach out to they know who you are. Even if they act like they don't like you at all. They know inside that if it came down to it they could walk in your door and you would be there and those are [00:23:52] that's where you start and hopefully eventually they come back and they come around and and they remember what you said. So I I also like the new program that's bringing the parents together because not only are they [00:24:07] meeting you is the resource and the other facilitators of your groups, but connecting with each other. I know a lot of times the communities the families are pretty isolated because of the hours that they work or you know transportation. [00:24:22] Issues communication issues parenting and it's all it's hard. So to meet other parents who have similar experiences and backgrounds and help them be a stronger Community is only going to give everybody just that [00:24:37] one more layer of support. So I love that that they're starting to come together.
Speaker 2: Absolutely and you know it even in the American culture. We've almost lost the ability to talk to her kids. [00:24:52] And so in especially in our Latino households, our parents are still very traditional but our kids because of what they listen to on the radio what they're watching on TV their involvement in school. They become Americanized [00:25:07] very quickly and we have that Clashing of cultures. And so when our in our parents are already have lost that ability to communicate and our kids don't want to communicate especially when they hit that [00:25:22] 14 15 16 year-old mark because at that point we know everything there is to know in the world and our parents don't know anything. So we work on Communications to stablish and guidelines establishing rules, [00:25:37] you know, and it becomes very healing and very helpful for our parents to hear that. Yes. You can establish a rule in your house.
Speaker 1: The I can't even imagine parenting is hard enough, you know when you're speaking the same language. [00:25:52] Jen you know the culture and you know what your what's going on for your kids. I can't imagine trying to learn the culture juggle the culture all the influences and the communication issues. So great things [00:26:07] to be teaching Families how one thing we mentioned briefly and just kind of in passing about the role working with the school system so I know from working with you [00:26:22] When I worked in that school system that that it's a great Cooperative effort between the police department and the school system. So I wanted to give you a chance to highlight that a little because I think it's a great model.
Speaker 2: [00:26:37] Um, honestly, it starts with the superintendent on down. I mean, I don't run into the superintendent that often but when I do he always wants to know what's going on in the community how he can help but [00:26:52] People that are rely on OWN on a daily basis or the bilingual facilitators and in the school's we collaborate pretty much every day going back and forth. You know, if I see a kid in the community [00:27:07] that's struggling. I'll give them the heads-up if they run across the kid that you know in the school, they'll give me the heads-up and a lot of times we'll team together and we'll talk to the parents will talk to the kids and go back and forth teachers and social workers Within. [00:27:22] The school's, you know just communicating with them, you know, I get calls from teachers and stuff all the time. You know, I'm I have this kid and I don't know what to do with it. And and the biggest thing with that [00:27:37] is I want to tell you is that we need to reach out as soon as we don't know what to do. No Reach Out gather your resources know who they are. And as soon as you start seeing that you're not connected [00:27:52] With a kid or you're worried about a kid reach out to those resources and let everybody start coming in on the one end. It's you can never have too much help getting really invested in a kid. We all do it [00:28:07] is good. And we feel good about being able to help those kids. But when we're working with kids that are heavily trauma and that trauma can be transferred onto us and if we don't watch what we're doing and [00:28:22] ignite has you know, hey, I'm starting to carry this child's trauma or this group's trauma. We need to seek help for ourselves and there's another piece that I want to add into that and a lot of times I run into people and [00:28:37] I said, well, you know mental health issue really is accepted in the Latino Community whenever I talk to Mom about mental health to judge me down. And that's I run into that myself, except I don't talk about mental health anymore. [00:28:52] I say hey, you know your son your daughter has expressed to me that she has these emotions that she really doesn't understand or doesn't know what to do with and at that point, you know, I think it's best if you go talk to this [00:29:07] doctor. Mental health never has to come into the conversation. That's really a biggest takeaway that I want. Everybody to know is that yeah, we can talk to the community about that. We just have to phrase it in a slightly different way
Speaker 1: [00:29:22] and I would like I want to challenge schools and communities to work together to support their teachers because like you're saying individual teachers get these little tidbits of information all throughout the day [00:29:37] every day. And we need to be prepared to support support our teachers so that when that happens they already know who to go to and where to go so that the delay you were talking about where we waited till the last minute [00:29:52] or we waited till the end of the school year if we have all of that together and ready at the beginning of the school year. So as soon as we see something our teachers know exactly what to do. Perfect. I look forward [00:30:07] to joining you in a couple of open on some of the programs. Maybe we can give a little glimpse into what the program's look like. Well were there visiting and have people understand the kinds of [00:30:22] things that you're doing, but I think you for taking time today. I know you probably have a hundred messages waiting on your phone from all those people looking for you
Speaker 2: so writing for inviting me.
Speaker 1: Yeah any time and any time [00:30:37] something comes up that you want to share with the community, you know, you're always welcome here. Very good. Thank you. Thanks. Have a good summer. You too.